In this podcast we cover Dr. MacDonald's deconstruction from fundamentalist evangelicalism and his subsequent shift of viewing the New Testament as foundationally mimetic of Homeric epics. We discussed how modern Christians are almost reinventing history by resurrecting the Jesus figure as a Jew, precisely the mimetic mechanism that Dr. MacDonald believes is foundational to the New Testament itself. 

I discussed a previous episode with Prof. Hillary Kaell as to how mimesis is at play with Christians identifying as 'messianic' today, something which I believe to be a deconstruction. In a sense they are mining new, more 'Jewish' elements from the gospels in order to rebuild an identity based on fundamentalism. Dr. MacDonald describes this as sheer ignorance and does not view the historical Jesus as the hero figure outlined in the New Testament from the various perspectives present there. 

We also tackled the now popular notion in messianic circles that the writings of Paul or the NT itself are affirming Torah observance. Dr. MacDonald severely criticised this as entirely unfounded and extremely selective readings of those documents. We also covered the attempt to rebrand the gospels as 'biographical accounts' as entirely unfounded.

He now advocates or a more holistic approach and asks those enthusiastic adherents to the New Testament to focus more on justice and compassion than trying to retrofit some level of Torah observance into their lives, which he feels is the hero arc of the NT itself.

See his website for more information - https://www.dennisrmacdonald.org/

As ever at Sefer Ground we want to affirm safe boundaries between Judaism and Christianity and help those caught in the middle. 

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He describes what he calls a 'phase two problem' where some ex-messianics struggle to embrace an authentically Jewish perspective of identity, scripture and tradition with lingering echoes of their Christological past being brought along as baggage unintentionally. He explains that the issue of belief in Jesus is only the first hurdle to overcome, a blip in the road so-to-speak and goes on to point out that the wider theological understanding of personal salvation can sometimes push potential converts into conversion needlessly and even sometimes for the wrong reasons. In a way there are Christological echoes bouncing back and forth which have a much deeper impact on the convert than the issue of Jesus himself, but the entire framework and belief system.

We also discuss the deeply problematic identity crisis caused by leaders who promote appropriation of Rabbinic Jewish customs as part of their programmes for potential congregants. He himself indulged in this as part of his mission to 'bring Christians out of the church and into Torah' and laments the damage caused by it.

He advocates strongly now for Noahidism for those emerging from the messianic movement, to give them a chance to fully understand Judaism as it is, in its own merit before making an informed decision about what to do next. He questions 'why convert?', whilst acknowledging some find themselves in the Jewish world as part of their journey, it need not be the end goal.

In this episode we also compassionately discuss the difficult issue of individuals who go so far into Jewish observance that they feel they should be given Jewish status despite doing so entirely outside of the Jewish people. We compare it to American citizenship, undergoing all the laws of naturalisation, but completely outside of the country and American communities. I describe this as a stage in deconstruction, still well, well within the Christian spectrum, even if on the surface it looks to be outside of it. The individual must be brave and decide 'on the ground' what life they want to live and which community to be part of.

At Sefer Ground we want to promote safe, respectful and healthy boundaries between the faiths and help those in the middle find safer and more authentic ways to approach spiritual tradition.

Articles 

- https://www.timesofisrael.com/how-an-arizona-pastor-parted-with-jesus-and-led-his-congregation-to-judaism/

- https://www.jpost.com/judaism/article-760766

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She explores the mechanisms by which Christian seekers become attracted to Jewish customs, rituals, culture and identity, while also reshaping their understanding of Jesus as a Jew who they feel should now be imitated.

Professor Kaell examines the complexity of what she calls “the problem of presence”: the idea that God manifests as a figure from another religion, departs, and is both inherently impossible to imitate and yet presented as someone who should be followed as an example. She also explains how this relates to gentile seekers who become intimately involved in 'Messianic' communities, and considers their role in communities where they vastly outnumber those with some form of Jewish connection.

We clearly outline the dangers to minority Jewish communities, raising the issue of appropriation and cultural erasure, as well as retrofitting later-developed Rabbinic customs for Christian purposes. Highlighted is also the problem of ever-worsening opinions of innocent Jewish communities as a result when their lifestyle and understanding of scripture and tradition doesn't fit into the model of Jewish-affinity Christianity.

We compare our experiences of the European landscape that appears increasingly fertile for deeper levels of appropriation from innocent Jewish communities. Finally, we reflect on what the future may hold for this ever fragmenting movement.

At Sefer Ground we want to foster clear, healthy boundaries between Christianity and Judaism, avoid appropriation and work together to build strong communities which find answers from within our traditions. I feel this episode explores why this began historically and continues to happen with keen, seeking Evangelical Christians and hope we can avoid misappropriating Jewishness as part of the trajectory.

See her website for more info - http://www.hillarykaell.com/

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In this episode I had the immense privilege of speaking with Rabbi Tovia Singer of Outreach Judaism regarding the Jewish response to 'messianic' attempts to convert Jews to Christianity. Rabbi Singer shares his experiences and insights into the evolving behaviours Christians are employing to convert Jews whilst also discussing the impact it has had on Jewish communities.

He discusses the irony that 'Jews for Jesus' have likely driven far more Christians to convert to authentic Judaism than Jews to become Christians due to the strong Jewish response to such dishonest conversion tactics.

We also discuss rogue groups of self-identifying messianic groups and their push to appropriate more and more Jewish emblems in order to try and form some sort of identity.

As ever on this podcast we want to promote healthy boundaries between Judaism and Christianity and in no way support the messianic movement nor its efforts to infiltrate Jewish communities. Rabbi Singer speaks beautifully of good and sincere Christian communities with whom he holds in high esteem, where that crosses the line into dishonest tactics to mimic Jews and especially for conversion however there must be a firm boundary.

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Steven, host of 'The Exodus Project' podcast, then shares how his daily life now looks as a firmly committed Noahide whilst we also reflected on getting help for those who have suffered spiritual and religious trauma and abuse as part of their journeys as well.

As part of the episode we address those caught in the middle, staging ground where, rather than confront the difficult internal questions head on, instead begin to appropriate Jewish, Rabbinic customs as a placeholder for the cultural deficit. Steven emphasises the importance of speaking to your pastor first and if still unsatisfied approach a fully-qualified and authentic Jewish Rabbi who would be more than willing to make space for questions, thought and exploration.

www.seferground.com

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In this episode the popular Counter-Missionary Yehuda Yisrael shares his unique insight and experiences protecting Jewishness on the front lines from Christians and messianics. He describes his process, what makes his approach unique and how he navigates high pressure witnessing and conversion environments from the Jewish perspective.

In Yehuda's unique style he shares how he manages to put himself in and navigate these scenarios, hoping that his interlocutors pause for thought and appreciate that Judaism has its own valid view and interpretation of scripture as-is, without requiring input or 'completion'.

This episode is tense because neither Jews nor Christians should have to apologise for their diametrically opposed views and understanding of scripture. The 2 positions haven't compromised in millennia and we can all get along. We want honesty, boundary and subsequent understanding. However conversions in Jewish communities happen at the tip of the spear and it is important for Jews and Christians to be aware of the strategies being employed by apologists and missionaries now: adopting Rabbinic literature and Hebrew as part of the arsenal.

I really wanted to hear input from a counter-missionary because most Christians are not aware of the new direction in outreach, nor that Jews have established answers for them. Those who infiltrate Jewish communities must be aware that Jews are entitled to maintain their own views of their own scriptures given to them in their time, covenant, language and understood within (not without) their own tradition and shouldn't be offended by that. 

Similarly Christians advocate for New Testament theology, arguing that Torah observance is no longer necessary. We see many materials about witnessing to Jews, this talk gives insight to Jews who are not going to concede to that, which is an interesting problem to those committed to outreach among Jewish communities.

We also address those appropriating Jewish identity and how insincere this is.

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Jeramiah also talks about high-control cult-like environments heavily linked to these ideologies and how leaders trap their sincere congregants, preventing them from going on to fully convert to actual Judaism. He advocates for factual research, the historical critical method and beliefs based on truth, but this approach in his view leads to healthier outcomes and believers free of high-control environments.

www.seferground.com

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In this episode we cover the issue, what can be done about it and Sefer Ground's mission to help those caught between Judaism and Christianity, to find authentic spiritual identities that don't rely on appropriation or borrowing in order to fill the gaps.

Please note: I am Jewish and in no way a Christian or 'messianic'. I affirm the boundaries between Judaism and Christianity and want to help those damaged by messianism and get to a better place, to safer (Sefer) ground.

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