Brian shares his journey from fundamentalism and eight years in the evangelical pastorate to a more inclusive way of following Jesus—one that replaces fear, punishment, and gatekeeping with curiosity, reclamation, and love. Together they explore how doctrines of eternal torment shape our image of God, our bodies, and our communities—and why removing hell from the center can actually deepen faith and free us to do the work of justice and mercy now.

Listen as we discuss:

• Growing up fundamentalist (yes, Bob Jones University) and the first “mini-deconstruction”

• Why fear of hell quietly programs our spirituality (and our church cultures)

• How punitive atonement stories make God the “bad guy” and stunt real transformation

• The demonic as forces that split us from God, self, and neighbor (not cartoon villains)

• Reclaiming practices, language, and church life after deconstruction

• Centering the margins: why Jesus starts with the last, lost, least, and left out

• Living the good news here and now vs. selling fire insurance for the afterlife

Brian Recker, M.Div, is a public theologian, speaker, and writer on Christian spirituality without exclusionary dogma. The son of a Baptist preacher and an alum of the fundamentalist Bob Jones University, he spent eight years as an evangelical pastor before deconstructing his faith to find a more inclusive spirituality. He now speaks about following Jesus without fear of hell on his popular Instagram account and his Substack, Beloved. He lives in Raleigh, North Carolina, and has four children and a rescue pup named Maev.

In this episode, we discuss:

• Jennie’s evolving faith—from devoted churchgoer to agnostic seeker

• The difference between “God Christians” and “Jesus Christians”

• How she finds connection and meaning through “the universe” and energy

• Why she still finds herself drawn to Jesus’ example of love and inclusion

• A new definition of love inspired by The Ohana Way:
  “I want the best for you. I want to be the best for you. I want you to have transcendent joy.”

• Journaling, introspection, and self-awareness as spiritual practice

• Humor, authenticity, and finding grounding in curiosity rather than certainty

Connect with our guest:
🎙️ Badass Direct Sales Mastery Podcast — badassdirectsalesmastery.com
💡 Follow Jennie for coaching, leadership, and entrepreneurial growth resources.

Jennie Bellinger is a certified professional coach, international best-selling author, and award-winning podcast host. Top direct sales leaders hire her to gain both financial and time freedom through effective leadership coaching. Known as the “Direct Sales Dom,” Jennie brings humor, candor, and strategy to everything she does. She’s also a two-time business owner, mom of two, and advocate for showing up authentically in every space. Her personal motto: “I don’t half-ass anything — I badass everything.”

Guest Bio