Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the best-selling books Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, which argue that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

The episode of Agile Tales continues a long-running conversation with Rich Sheridan. Rich discusses how Menlo’s pairing practices can include neurodivergent team members, noting they’ve employed people on the spectrum and that social skills develop through practice rather than isolation; he argues many “cantankerous” behaviors are created by silent, cubicle-based environments and should be addressed with structures for respectful conflict, drawing on Crucial Conversations and a kindergarten “solution circle” model, while still expecting basic human decency. He explains executive influence through visible signals, humility, and accepting feedback, then describes fostering autonomy via “run the experiment,” minimizing meetings, and using shorthand cultural phrases like “black butterflies” to challenge assumptions and reduce fear-driven resistance.

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales
• 01:40 Neurodivergence and Pairing
• 04:45 Isolation Creates Friction
• 08:20 Solution Circle Skills
• 11:49 Respect and System Design
• 16:52 Leading by Signals
• 21:32 Run the Experiment
• 27:27 Black Butterflies Story
• 29:49 Closing and Next Episode

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work but also what it feels like to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations' tours and workshops at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the best-selling books Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, which argue that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

In this episode, Rich contrasts default culture with intentional culture, warning that values confined to posters and CEO “rah-rah” speeches breed cynicism unless reinforced through recruiting, interviewing, onboarding, feedback, promotion, and firing practices. He emphasizes “alignment” among outside perception, inside reality, and the leader’s heart, noting misalignment creates organizational drag and even motivates companies to game culture awards. Using Menlo examples—public tours, pair-based work, an “extreme interview,” one-day and three-week trials, and peer-based “prosperity reviews”—he shows how clear signals and truth-telling sustain culture, including allowing negative Glassdoor feedback and using it for reflection.

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales
• 01:40 Management Training Gap
• 02:57 Podcast Legacy and Impact
• 05:42 Default vs Intentional Culture
• 09:28 Alignment Heart Reality Perception
• 13:15 Tours and Truth in Action
• 19:15 Hiring Extreme Interview Signals
• 21:15 Peer Reviews and Mentorship Culture
• 24:36 Glassdoor Free Speech and Feedback
• 28:18 Closing and Next Episode

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work but also what it feels like to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations' tours and workshops at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the best-selling books Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, which argue that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

In this episode, Rich argues that scaling requires adaptation and that large organizations are effectively collections of smaller teams, best changed through experiments rather than mandates, citing Nationwide’s adoption of Menlo-inspired practices. He explains why Menlo has remained around 50 people, noting financial constraints without investors or debt, and the need to grow responsibly without harming culture, while adding leadership and managerial processes after consecutive strong years. He contrasts “default culture,” which emerges from tolerated behaviors and often becomes complaint-driven, with “intentional culture,” reinforced through storytelling and embedded in HR practices. He critiques hero-based organizations as burnout-prone and sustained by recognition rewards, and describes changing manager behavior by replacing those rewards and breaking learned leadership patterns.

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales?
• 01:40 Can Joy Scale?
• 04:02 Growing Past Fifty
• 07:21 Default Versus Intentional Culture
• 08:30 Stories That Shape Culture
• 13:28 Hero Cultures Explained
• 17:23 Pressure Reveals Values
• 22:28 Changing Hero Rewards
• 26:40 Why Managers Repeat Hero-based Patterns
• 28:06 Rich's Turning Point
• 30:08 Closing And Next Time

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work but also what it feels like to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations' tours and workshops at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the best-selling books Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, which argue that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

In this episode, Rich clarifies that “bench” engineers rotate systematically among internal and client work, and that bugs are handled as regular story cards scheduled by clients rather than as a separate firefighting function; he attributes Menlo’s record of only two software emergencies in 23 years to pairing, frequent pair rotation, test-driven design, and fast feedback. He contrasts this with demoralizing bug triage cultures and “tower of knowledge” single points of failure, describing how pairing reduces risk and avoids trapping experts. On the client side, Menlo offers flexible, discounted contracts while committing to never stopping a project (keeping at least one pair assigned) and allowing customers to switch to full-rate priority if needed. More importantly, Rich defines joy as delighting end users by involving them directly and measuring joy through weekly show-and-tell feedback, and he argues these disciplines can scale, citing Menlo’s training of 400 staff at Nationwide Financial and influence on a 10,000-person IT organization.

• 00:00 Welcom to Our Agile Tales
• 01:41 No Bench Engineers
• 02:55 Bugs and Broken Systems
• 04:46 Demoralizing Bug Culture
• 06:50 Flexible Deadlines Explained
• 09:20 Pairing as Secret Sauce
• 10:11 Towers of Knowledge Risk
• 13:00 Defining Joy at Menlo
• 14:47 Programmers Want Impact
• 17:47 Measuring Joy Weekly Feedback
• 22:39 Engineers Talking to Users
• 23:24 Freedom Through Discipline
• 25:24 Scaling to Big Orgs
• 28:17 Closing and Next Episode

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work but also what it feels like to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations' tours and workshops at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the best-selling books Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, which argue that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

In this episode, we focus on Menlo’s pairing practices for all roles, not just software engineers, to strengthen culture, knowledge sharing, and sustainable pace. Rich describes Menlo’s near-no-overtime norm (about 40–45 hours), a four-week vacation policy reinforced by peer pressure against checking messages, and how coverage and shared context prevent single points of failure. He explains how Menlo avoids overtime when clients demand more work by adding people and rotating pairs every five business days to “break” Brooks’s Law, enabling projects to scale up or down smoothly. Staffing flexibility comes from internal “bench” projects, discounted “flexible deadline” arrangements that allow shifting staff between clients, and a strong culture that attracts a steady flow of resumes through tours, books, and public sharing.

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales
• 01:39 Pairing Beyond Coding
• 02:29 No Overtime Real Vacations
• 05:31 Vacation Coverage System
• 09:08 Beating Brooks Law
• 10:36 Bench Projects Flex Capacity
• 12:02 Flexible Deadline Discount
• 21:15 Airline Seats Pricing Analogy
• 26:44 Hiring Pipeline Culture Magnet
• 29:38 Closing and Next Episode

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work but also what it feels like to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations' tours and workshops at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the best-selling books Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, which argue that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

In this episode, after a story of engineers hiding when a boss arrives late on a Friday, Rich explains how fear shuts down the brain functions needed for creativity, imagination, invention, and innovation, and suggests responding to “that won’t work here” with “why don’t we try it before we defeat it?” He shares how MassMutual used desk balloons to signal experiments, increasing energy and initiative, and contrasts fear-based accountability with “circular accountability,” including an Atlanta seminar where a VP recognized fear-driven management was harming results. Rich then describes Menlo’s intentional culture and hiring: valuing “good kindergarten skills,” using tours as recruitment, and conducting “extreme interviews” with paired candidates, paid real-work trials, and a focus on supporting others.

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales
• 01:38 A Friday Fear Story
• 03:22 Fear Kills Innovation
• 04:21 Try It Before Defeat
• 06:04 MassMutual Balloon Experiments
• 10:23 Why Fear Fails Leaders
• 11:28 Circular Accountability Lesson
• 16:27 Menlo Culture and Hiring
• 16:55 Kindergarten Skills Hiring
• 18:58 Tours and Culture Alignment
• 23:22 Extreme Interview Process
• 27:06 Paid Trials and Onboarding
• 29:41 Closing and Next Episode

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work but also what it feels like to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations' tours and workshops at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the best-selling books Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, which argue that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

In this episode, Rich explains Menlo’s “High Tech Anthropology,” a patented term for designers who study end users in their native environments to learn workflows and vocabulary, aiming to end “human suffering” caused by technology and create software that delights without manuals or training. He shares examples of widespread frustration with systems such as electronic medical records and ERP systems, then revisits the Langley vs. Wright brothers story to highlight purpose-driven discovery. He then presents an airplane model for organizations: lift of human energy over the weight of bureaucracy, and thrust of purpose over the drag of fear, emphasizing clarity, completing meaningful work, reducing meeting load, taking action through experiments, and eliminating fear-based management.

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales
• 01:46 High Tech Anthropology Explained
• 04:30 Designing for Real Users
• 06:59 Why Software Causes Suffering
• 09:14 Wright Brothers Purpose Story
• 14:23 Airplane Model for Organizations
• 16:44 Lift Human Energy at Work
• 19:09 Meetings and Bureaucracy Trap
• 22:17 Drag of Fear Leadership
• 24:39 Closing and Next Episode

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work but also what it feels like to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations' tours and workshops at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the best-selling books Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, which argue that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

In this episode, we asked Rich whether removing meetings changes culture, and he avoids a blanket “no meetings” rule and instead distinguishes unproductive meetings from structured rituals (kickoffs, estimation, show-and-tell, planning games) with clear roles, artifacts, decision capture, and visible system effects, drawing on systems thinking from Peter Senge’s The Fifth Discipline. He argues disengagement reflects management’s failure to create conditions and an intentional culture (at Menlo, defined by “joy” and expected behaviors like pairing and sharing). He urges an external focus that extends even to employees’ families, citing Menlo’s practice of allowing newborns at work. To overcome “that won’t work here” drag from anyone, he advocates “Let’s try it before we defeat it—run the experiment,” emphasizing small, low-risk experiments, trust, and purpose as a simple, memorable guide through tough times and culture shifts like mergers, reinforced through daily practices and HR processes (noting Menlo has no HR department).

Key topics and timestamps:

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales
• 01:37 Meetings vs Rituals
• 03:58 Systems That Reduce Drag
• 05:31 Intentional Culture Basics
• 06:56 Beyond Customers Impact
• 08:14 Babies at Work Story
• 11:51 Try It Before Defeat
• 15:39 Experiment Culture Spreads
• 18:28 Measuring Experiments Trust
• 19:56 Purpose That Endures Storms
• 22:37 Transform Default Culture
• 26:16 Closing

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work but also what it feels like to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations' tours and workshops at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the bests-selling books, Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, whose message is that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

In this episode Rich argues that fear shuts down the brain functions organizations need—creativity, imagination, invention, and innovation—and describes common, often subtle, fear-inducing management behaviors like overload, ambiguity, and constant reprioritization. He shares a Menlo Innovation story where he inadvertently scolded an employee under a poster reading “It's okay to say I don’t know,” and how a long-tenured teammate compassionately held him accountable, leading to an apology and learning. 

Using an airplane analogy, he maps organizational success to increasing human energy (lift) over bureaucracy (weight), strengthening purpose (thrust), and reducing fear (drag). He explains how Menlo pumps fear out through pair programming, frequent pairing rotation, an interview process emphasizing helping others succeed, leading without bosses, and replacing long status meetings with a short daily standup that exposes problems without solving them in-meeting.

Key topics and timestamps:

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales
• 01:46 Fear Kills Innovation
• 04:59 Everyday Fear Triggers
• 08:04 Owning Your Mistakes
• 12:19 Why Fear Lingers
• 13:59 Airplane Forces Model
• 19:05 Defining Human Energy
• 21:22 Pumping Fear Out
• 24:41 Leading Without Bosses
• 27:17 Meetings That Drain Teams
• 27:37 Daily Standup Fix
• 29:54 Closing 

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work, but how it feels to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

You can check out Menlo Innovations tours and workshop at: https://menloinnovations.com/tours-and-workshops

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Aside from founding and leading Menlo Innovations, Rich is also the author of the bests-selling books, Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, whose message is that joy is essential to productivity and profitability in the workplace. Rich recounts his journey from early programming success and a rapid rise to VP to feeling despondent amid chaotic, late, over-budget software delivery, which sparked a search for better ways to organize people. 

He defines workplace joy as externally focused delight in serving end users, distinct from perks or simple happiness. He describes an “aha” moment when his eight-year-old daughter observed that no one could make decisions without him, revealing a hero-based organization, and a “click” moment in 1999 influenced by Kent Beck’s Extreme Programming Explained, IDEO’s Nightline segment, and meeting his co-founder, James Goebel.

Rich details early resistance to pair programming, how experiments and a “Java factory” open-room approach shifted behavior, and how the internet bubble burst led him to found Menlo Innovations in 2001. He explains how IBM tours and a conference invitation launched his storytelling and how Edison’s Menlo lab inspired Menlo’s name, concluding that the risk of change was less than the risk of staying the same.

Key topics and timestamps:

• 00:00 Welcome to Our Agile Tales
• 00:22 Meet Rich Sheridan
• 02:30 From Programmer to Burnout
• 05:53 Defining Joy at Work
• 08:21 Aha Moment Leadership Shift
• 10:36 Click Moment XP and IDEO
• 12:53 Pairing Experiment Begins
• 15:54 Java Factory Culture Change
• 19:19 Menlo Innovations Is Born
• 20:59 Joyful Workdays No Overtime
• 22:38 Tour Guide to Storyteller
• 28:04 Risk of Change vs Staying
• 30:05 Closing

About Rich Sheridan

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations and the best-selling author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. He has spent years traveling across four continents and nearly 20 countries, helping organizations rethink not just how they work, but how it feels to be part of them. His core message is simple: joy isn’t optional—it’s essential to productivity, profitability, and real team energy.

Rich’s ideas have been featured in Forbes, Inc., NPR, and Harvard Business Review. What sets him apart is that he’s been living these principles for over 20 years at Menlo, the company he co-founded in Ann Arbor, Michigan—now known worldwide for its uniquely joyful culture.

Follow Rich Sheridan at: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this final episode of the series, we discuss with Bjarte what distinguishes business models (external interaction) from management models (internal organization). He introduces the Viable Map, inspired by the Business Model Canvas, to help management teams assess their management model against the 12 Beyond Budgeting principles, considering business environment from SUSO (simple, understood, stable, orderly) to VUCA and employees on a Theory X–Y scale. He emphasizes the need for coherence between values/purpose-based leadership claims and often “fixed” budgeting processes, calling mismatches “poisonous gaps.” He argues listed companies can adopt beyond budgeting, as markets want sustainable performance, and recommends starting by separating budget purposes—targets, forecasts, and resource allocation—implemented in parallel. He contrasts beyond budgeting’s enterprise-wide focus with Agile’s origins in software, shares disappointing and rewarding client experiences, and points listeners to bbrt.org and key books.

Key topics and timestamps

• 00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro
• 01:09 Business vs Management Models
• 01:59 Viable Map Framework
• 05:16 Assessing Coherence Gaps
• 08:02 Empowerment Needs Process Change
• 09:40 Markets Wall Street Myths
• 12:08 Why Beyond Budgeting Sticks
• 14:34 Where to Start Separating Budgets
• 17:45 Pilots vs Big Bang
• 19:12 Disappointing Transformation Story
• 21:20 Most Rewarding Successes
• 23:06 Learn More About Beyond Budgeting
• 25:20 Wrap Up and Next Series

About Bjarte Bogsnes

Bjarte Bogsnes is Chairman of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table, a former global finance executive, and a leading thinker in management innovation. He is the author of Implementing Beyond Budgeting and This Is Beyond Budgeting, showing how organizations can replace rigid, calendar-driven systems with models built on trust, transparency, and adaptability — creating companies that are both more responsive and more human.

Follow Bjarte at:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjarte-bogsnes-41557910/

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, we discuss with Bjarte  how target setting evolved at Equinor from 2005 onward through separating target setting, forecasting, and resource allocation, including allowing indicators without targets and emphasizing team-set, often more ambitious goals and relative “reality targets” versus peers. Bjarte says Beyond Budgeting adoption spans many industries, is stronger in Europe, and is equally relevant in the public sector, citing Norway’s NAV contact centers eliminating cost budgets and a 12,000-inhabitant municipality using self-managed teams, continuous decisions, and stakeholder alignment while still submitting an external “budget.” He argues budgets embed distrust and predictability assumptions, making true agility impossible without Beyond Budgeting, challenges absolute annual financial targets, and advocates relative targets, holistic evaluation, and common incentives. Finally, he describes surveys by Boston Consulting Group and Bain & Company linking Beyond Budgeting to benefits like higher sales and leading financial planning practices.

Key topics and timestamps

• 00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro
• 01:06 Evolving Targets at Equinor
• 03:39 Who Adopts Beyond Budgeting
• 05:14 Public Sector Breakthroughs
• 05:41 NAV Pilot No Cost Budgets
• 07:10 Municipality Self Managed Teams
• 10:00 Funding Constraints Not Earmarks
• 14:24 Why Budgets Block Agility
• 18:24 No Budget No Targets
• 22:09 Forecasting and Ambition
• 23:28 Consulting Surveys and Benefits
• 27:16 Wrap Up and Next Episode

About Bjarte Bogsnes

Bjarte Bogsnes is Chairman of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table, a former global finance executive, and a leading thinker in management innovation. He is the author of Implementing Beyond Budgeting and This Is Beyond Budgeting, showing how organizations can replace rigid, calendar-driven systems with models built on trust, transparency, and adaptability — creating companies that are both more responsive and more human.

Follow Bjarte at:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjarte-bogsnes-41557910/

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, we ask why Silicon Valley firms rarely appear in Beyond Budgeting case studies; Bjarte posits that these companies excel at technology innovation but fear management innovation, sometimes reinforced by IPO-focused CFOs, though being public is not a true barrier (Many Beyond Budgeting adopters are listed on Wall Street.) 

He explains Beyond Budgeting can improve performance in both good and tough times and cites Handelsbanken’s long-term stability. The discussion covers Morningstar’s self-management and the need for enterprise-wide coherence, then Haier’s radical micro-enterprise model and rapid evolution.

Finally, Bjarte details Equinor’s (formerly Statoil) beyond budgeting journey since 2005 via “Ambition to Action,” integrating strategy, risk, actions/forecasting, indicators, and HR with a 50/50 split between “what” and “how,” emphasizing transparency, event-driven cadence, decentralized ownership, and holistic performance evaluation.

Key topics and timestamps

• 00:00 Welcome
• 01:05 Why Silicon Valley Lags in Management Innovation
• 04:11 Public Markets and Budgets
• 04:53 Boom Bust and Stability
• 06:40 Morningstar and Self Management
• 08:48 Haier Radical Micro Enterprises
• 13:00 Equinor Beyond Budgeting Origins
• 16:32 Ambition to Action Framework
• 20:11 Alignment Cadence and Transparency
• 25:37 Holistic Performance Evaluation
• 28:15 Wrap Up and Conclusion

About Bjarte Bogsnes

Bjarte Bogsnes is Chairman of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table, a former global finance executive, and a leading thinker in management innovation. He is the author of Implementing Beyond Budgeting and This Is Beyond Budgeting, showing how organizations can replace rigid, calendar-driven systems with models built on trust, transparency, and adaptability — creating companies that are both more responsive and more human.

Follow Bjarte at:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjarte-bogsnes-41557910/

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, Bjarte discusses David Lloyd Clubs’ Beyond Budgeting shift starting in October 2019 and how it helped during the 2020 pandemic through greater local autonomy and faster, more continuous funding decisions. He explains the core change of separating budget purposes into distinct processes for target setting, forecasting (as non-binding forecasts), and resource allocation, with more local decision-making and a revised cadence beyond annual budgets. Bogsnes addresses budget gaming by isolating it to target setting and using relative performance and transparency to encourage improvement while avoiding naming-and-shaming, emphasizing holistic performance evaluation when measures are absolute. 

The conversation also covers beyond budgeting relevance to the public sector via a pilot in Sogndal Municipality, Norway, and TDR Capital’s role as a private equity owner encouraging portfolio companies to adopt beyond budgeting, including examples like Stonegate and BPP.

Key topics and timestamps

• 00:00 Welcome
• 01:06 Pandemic Autonomy Lessons
• 02:54 Separating Budget Purposes
• 06:11 Funding Autonomy And Cadence
• 07:28 Stopping Gaming With Benchmarks
• 12:31 Transparency Without Shaming
• 14:24 All 12 Principles In Practice
• 15:05 Beyond Budgeting In Government
• 20:04 Collaboration And Member Impact
• 22:45 TDR Capital’s Playbook
• 25:41 How To Start The Journey
• 27:15 Private Equity Differentiator
• 28:11 Wrap Up and Conclusion

About Bjarte Bogsnes

Bjarte Bogsnes is Chairman of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table, a former global finance executive, and a leading thinker in management innovation. He is the author of Implementing Beyond Budgeting and This Is Beyond Budgeting, showing how organizations can replace rigid, calendar-driven systems with models built on trust, transparency, and adaptability — creating companies that are both more responsive and more human.

Follow Bjarte at:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjarte-bogsnes-41557910/

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, we examine Beyond Budgeting through two case studies: Miles and David Lloyd Clubs.

Miles is a Norwegian IT consulting company founded in reaction to command-and-control micromanagement. It operates without budgets and with minimal KPIs, guided by an evergreen financial ambition of maintaining a profit margin above 10%  without cascaded targets or bonus links. Employees enjoy wide autonomy, with transparency as the primary control mechanism: purchases and training costs are posted on the intranet for shared learning.

Miles places strong emphasis on recruitment and cultural fit, taking at least ten references and interviewing for beliefs, values, and attitudes. Employees assess technical skills and can veto candidates. The company invests heavily in social cohesion, including spouse-only events, and practices servant leadership, with the CEO retitling himself “Chief Servant Leader.” Bjarte notes that Miles was essentially “born beyond budgeting” and has sustained its principles through growth by consciously resisting bureaucracy, including internal leadership succession.

The second case study, David Lloyd Clubs, a high-end UK gym chain with around 300 clubs, represents one of the fastest Beyond Budgeting implementations Bjarte has seen: launched in October 2019 and fully budget-free by January 2021. The model helped the company not only survive COVID-19 but emerge stronger.

Key practices included increased club autonomy, strong internal benchmarking, transparency, and local involvement in KPI selection. Central target setting was reduced, with emphasis on relative performance rather than detailed annual targets tied to bonuses.

Ownership by private equity firm TDR Capital supported the shift, focusing on leadership and management improvement rather than cost-cutting.

Bjarte attributes the speed to strong owner backing, a capable controller leading the effort, and a supportive CEO, while noting that mindset change takes longer than process change. HR played a key role in shifting performance evaluation toward relative measures and maintaining shared club-level bonuses instead of individual incentives.

Key topics and timestamps

• 00:00 Welcome
• 01:07 Miles Overview
• 02:47 Transparency Over Budgets
• 04:15 Recruiting and Culture
• 06:05 Servant Leadership
• 06:46 Born Beyond Budgeting
• 10:37 Sustaining Beliefs at Scale
• 12:23 David Lloyd Clubs
• 13:09 Rapid Rollout
• 13:56 Benchmarking and Rhythm
• 17:41 Why It Worked
• 20:53 Relative Performance
• 24:45 Transparency and Learning
• 26:47 HR and Rewards
• 28:15 Results and Conclusion

About Bjarte Bogsnes

Bjarte Bogsnes is Chairman of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table, a former global finance executive, and a leading thinker in management innovation. He is the author of Implementing Beyond Budgeting and This Is Beyond Budgeting, showing how organizations can replace rigid, calendar-driven systems with models built on trust, transparency, and adaptability — creating companies that are both more responsive and more human.

Follow Bjarte at:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjarte-bogsnes-41557910/

Music: https://www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode of 'Our Agile Tales,' we welcome back Bjarte Bogsnes, Chairman of Beyond Budgeting Round Table, to explore the principles and practices of Beyond Budgeting. Bogsnes shares his extensive experience and insights on how Beyond Budgeting can drive performance by empowering employees and promoting coherence across management processes. The conversation delves into Handelsbanken's unique approach to employee bonuses, performance reviews, promotions, and training, highlighting the bank's emphasis on long-term employee development and consistent management philosophies. This episode offers valuable lessons for companies looking to create more adaptive and human organizations.

Key topics and approximate timestamps

• 00:00 Introduction to Our Agile Tales
• 01:20 Beyond Budgeting and Performance Reviews
• 01:54 The Common Bonus Scheme
• 03:29 Coherence in Management Processes
• 05:46 Handling Non-Performance
• 07:48 KPIs and Performance Enabling
• 09:59 Sales Commissions and Career Paths
• 16:49 Training and Onboarding at Handelsbanken
• 20:58 Final Thoughts on Handelsbanken
• 25:02 Episode Conclusion 

About Bjarte Bogsnes

Bjarte Bogsnes is the Chairman of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table, a former global finance executive, and a leading thinker in management innovation. He is the author of Implementing Beyond Budgeting and This Is Beyond Budgeting, where he distills nearly three decades of real-world experience challenging traditional budgeting, targets, and control-based management.

Bjarte's work demonstrates how organizations can replace rigid, calendar-driven systems with models built on trust, transparency, and adaptability. The result is creating companies that are not only more responsive but also more human.

You can follow Bjarte Bogsnes at https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjarte-bogsnes-41557910/

Our music is from https://www.purple-planet.com.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, we discuss the ingrained corporate budgeting practices, their inefficacies, and how to shift towards more adaptive, event-driven planning. The conversation also delves into the performance management debate and examines Handelsbanken's exceptional model, a bank that has successfully operated without traditional budgets, targets, or individual bonuses since the 1970s. Bjarte emphasizes the importance of separating accounting from forward-looking planning and highlights the impact of empowering employees and fostering transparency in achieving organizational success.

Key topics and approximate timestamps

• 00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
• 01:08 Challenges with Traditional Budgeting
• 02:04 Separating Accounting from Forward Planning
• 03:49 The Importance of Dynamic Management
• 05:47 Rethinking Performance Management
• 09:42 Case Study: Handelsbanken
• 13:50 The Origins of Handelsbanken's Approach
• 17:59 The Evolution of Beyond Budgeting
• 20:46 Handelsbanken's Unique Management Model
• 29:30 Episode Conclusion

About Bjarte Bogsnes

Bjarte Bogsnes is the Chairman of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table, a former global finance executive, and a leading thinker in management innovation. He is the author of Implementing Beyond Budgeting and This Is Beyond Budgeting, where he distills nearly three decades of real-world experience challenging traditional budgeting, targets, and control-based management.

Bjarte's work demonstrates how organizations can replace rigid, calendar-driven systems with models built on trust, transparency, and adaptability. The result is creating companies that are not only more responsive but also more human.

You can follow Bjarte Bogsnes at https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjarte-bogsnes-41557910/

Our music is from https://www.purple-planet.com.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

We have brought back Bjarte Bogsnes, Chairman of Beyond Budgeting Round Table, and is a popular international business speaker and Beyond Budgeting coach. He is an award-winning author and long-time champion of more adaptive human organizations. In this series of episodes, Bjarte reflects on 25 years of management innovation and the evolution of Beyond Budgeting far beyond its financial origins.

Our episode starts with a refresher on what Beyond Budgeting is, and why it is so often misunderstood as "just a finance thing." From there, we explore how deeply traditional management assumptions shape behavior, trust, and decision-making inside organizations. Bjarte uses metaphors, real-world examples, and decades of experience to explain why many well-intended Agile and Lean transformations stall or fail if they don't address and rethink the management processes. We dive into Theory X and Theory Y, the hidden damage caused by fixed targets and calendar-driven planning, and how separating targets, forecasts, and resource allocation can fundamentally change behavior. Throughout the episode, Bjarte makes the case that true business agility requires coherence and alignment between leadership principles and management systems. Without this alignment, successful long-term transformations will not be achieved.

Key topics and approximate timestamps

• 00:00 – Introduction to Our Agile Tales
• 01:52 – Why Beyond Budgeting is not about finance—and why the name still matters
• 04:30 – Challenging traditional management assumptions: trust and predictability
• 07:10 – Leadership principles vs. management processes: where companies break coherence
• 10:00 – Why Agile and Lean need Beyond Budgeting to scale at the enterprise level
• 13:21 – Theory X and Theory Y: how beliefs about people shape management models
• 16:40 – The problem with combining targets, forecasts, and resource allocation
• 18:30 – Gaming, sandbagging, and unintended consequences of budgeting systems
• 20:24 – What's wrong with traditional targets—and how relative targets change behavior
• 23:10 – Moving from calendar-driven planning to business- and event-driven rhythms
• 26:00 – Continuous decision-making as a Beyond Budgeting version of continuous delivery
• 28:29 – Closing reflections and broader implications for adaptive organizations

About Bjarte Bogsnes

Bjarte Bogsnes is the Chairman of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table, a former global finance executive, and a leading thinker in management innovation. He is the author of Implementing Beyond Budgeting and This Is Beyond Budgeting, where he distills nearly three decades of real-world experience challenging traditional budgeting, targets, and control-based management.

Bjarte's work demonstrates how organizations can replace rigid, calendar-driven systems with models built on trust, transparency, and adaptability. The result is creating companies that are not only more responsive but also more human.

You can follow Bjarte Bogsnes at https://www.linkedin.com/in/bjarte-bogsnes-41557910/

Our music is from https://www.purple-planet.com.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, we continue our conversation with Ondřej Dvořák, CEO of Agile Lawyer and COP Solutions, and co-founder of LinkingHelp. Building on his experience supporting Ukrainian refugees, Ondřej shares how Agile practices like Scrum and Kanban made it possible to coordinate large-scale, cross-border legal aid while respecting privacy and professional responsibility.

We explore how visibility and transparency enabled fast action without exposing sensitive data, why government funding often moves too slowly for crisis response, and how donation-driven initiatives struggle once a crisis becomes the “new normal.” Ondřej argues that sustainable humanitarian work must blend social impact with viable business models.

The conversation also dives into AI in legal services—not as a silver bullet, but as an accelerator that only works once processes, data, and transparency are in place. We discuss why AI should assist lawyers rather than replace them, the data-protection concerns slowing adoption, and what the future holds for agile, AI-assisted law firms.

Episode Outline

• 00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
• 00:53 Agility in Humanitarian Efforts
• 02:12 Transparency and Visibility in Legal Aid
• 03:55 Challenges with Government Bureaucracy
• 05:39 LinkingHelp's Broader Impact
• 07:53 AI's Role in Legal Services
• 11:11 Future of AI and Agile in Law
• 22:07 Key Takeaways and Advice
• 23:43 Conclusion 

About Ondrej Dvorak

Ondřej is the co-founder of Linking Help, a nonprofit that mobilized legal aid for Ukrainian refugees using Scrum and Kanban to coordinate real-time support. It’s a powerful story of how agility can make a real difference in humanitarian crises—far beyond the domain of business. Andre’s work shows how Agile thinking can help even the most traditional sectors become more humane, responsive, and resilient. 

You can follow Ondřej on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/ondrej-dvorak-agile/

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this continuation of our conversation with Ondřej Dvořák, CEO of AgiLawyer and COPS Solutions, we go deeper into how you actually run and scale an agile, cross-border legal-aid initiative in the middle of a war. If the first episode was about launching Linking Help, this one is about surviving the scale-up.

Ondřej walks us through the messy, very human side of scaling legal aid for Ukrainian refugees: from dealing with thousands of requests in a language he didn’t speak, to building a “clearing desk” and help desk function led by Ukrainian lawyers, to teaching volunteer lawyers across multiple countries how to work in a pull-based, Kanban system when they’re used to command-and-control and assigned work.

We explore how culture and ways of working showed up in very concrete ways - why France “just got it” from day one, while countries like Romania needed more support and education before becoming top performers. Ondřej talks about how simplifying the Kanban system (fewer columns, fewer concepts, one clear task: connect the person to a lawyer) was crucial to onboarding busy legal professionals quickly in a crisis.

We also dig into scaling patterns: how they expanded country by country, used “early adopter” lawyers to grow local networks, and centralized the help desk while keeping case work decentralized. From there, the conversation shifts to constraints: the difficulty of fundraising for legal aid (which is hard to “picture”), differences in how pro bono is treated across jurisdictions, and the legal and ethical challenges of using AI to support legal work, especially questions of accountability and liability when AI-generated guidance might be wrong.

If you’re interested in how Agile, Kanban, and crisis-driven decision-making play out in the real world, across borders, cultures, and regulatory systems, then this episode is a rich case study in making agility practical, humane, and scalable beyond software.

Episode Outline

• 00:00 Introduction & recap of Part 1
• 01:05 The language barrier: Ukrainian requests and the need for a “clearing desk”
• 07:58 Designing the help desk workflow
• 10:45 Teaching lawyers a new way of working: pull vs. command-and-control
• 13:12 Culture in action: why France “just worked” and Romania needed more coaching
• 16:00 Simplifying Kanban for legal work
• 18:48 Scaling country by country: early adopters, bar associations, and building local communities
• 22:10 Centralized help desk, decentralized service: funding, hiring Ukrainian students, and managing demand
• 24:55 Business model and funding constraints: the challenge of raising money for legal aid
• 26:10 Legal and AI constraints: pro bono differences, AI-assisted legal opinions, and accountability
• 28:30 Reflections on crisis as a catalyst and the future of global, AI-supported legal aid
• 29:07 Conclusion

About Ondrej Dvorak

Ondřej is the co-founder of Linking Help, a nonprofit that mobilized legal aid for Ukrainian refugees using Scrum and Kanban to coordinate real-time support. It’s a powerful story of how agility can make a real difference in humanitarian crises—far beyond the domain of business. Andre’s work shows how Agile thinking can help even the most traditional sectors become more humane, responsive, and resilient. 

You can follow Ondřej on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/ondrej-dvorak-agile/

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this series of episodes, we are joined by Ondřej Dvořák, CEO of AgiLawyer and COPS Solutions, and someone proving that agility isn’t limited to software teams or startups. With over 15 years at the crossroads of IT, law and finance, Ondřej has been bringing Agile principles into fields few consider “Agile-friendly.”

In this first episode, Ondřej explains how Agile methodologies like Scrum and Kanban can transform even the most traditional industries, including legal services. He details his initiatives, such as the non-profit Linking Help, which utilized Agile frameworks to aid Ukrainian refugees. Ondřej shares how he sparked Agile adoption in the legal sector by addressing common barriers and educating legal professionals on these methods. Additionally, he discusses the practical challenges and solutions implemented in real-world environments, emphasizing the adaptability and resilience that Agile offers, even in chaotic situations such as war. The discussion highlights the importance of Agile education for students and how it can prepare them for dynamic work environments.

• 00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
• 00:17 Meet Ondřej Dvořák
• 03:14 Applying Agile to the Legal Industry
• 07:18 Challenges and Objections in Legal Agile Transformation
• 14:09 Agile Education for Law Students
• 16:42 Linking Help: Agile in Humanitarian Aid
• 20:44 Building and Scaling Linking Help
• 29:07 Conclusion 

About Ondrej Dvorak

Ondřej is the co-founder of Linking Help, a nonprofit that mobilized legal aid for Ukrainian refugees using Scrum and Kanban to coordinate real-time support. It’s a powerful story of how agility can make a real difference in humanitarian crises—far beyond the domain of business. Andre’s work shows how Agile thinking can help even the most traditional sectors become more humane, responsive, and resilient. 

You can follow Ondřej on LinkedIn at  https://www.linkedin.com/in/ondrej-dvorak-agile/

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

• 00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
• 00:44 Transforming Financial Planning
• 02:12 Challenges of Leadership Changes
• 02:50 Empowering Organizational Change
• 05:18 Finance Team's Reaction to Change
• 08:28 Improving Communication and Processes
• 10:04 Addressing Risk and Fear in Finance
• 12:06 Overcoming Traditional Finance Barriers
• 16:15 Leading Change from Within
• 20:08 Advice for Finance and Non-Finance Teams
• 26:09 Conclusion and Upcoming Episode Teaser

Nevine's insights highlight that there’s no one-size-fits-all playbook for financial agility. Instead, transformation requires experimentation, iteration, and courage to question the sacred cows of yearly budgets. Her experiences demonstrate how finance—often seen as the last function to change—can become a catalyst for business agility, resilience, and innovation. She is a Senior VP of Finance at Greater Technology Together and a member of the Beyond Budgeting Round Table. Nevine has spent nearly two decades guiding organizations through the shift from rigid annual budgets to adaptive, rolling financial frameworks that enable true business agility.

About Nevine White:
Beginning her 35-year career in telecom engineering, Nevine went on to lead the FP&A function at TW Telecom for 2 decades. There, she championed powerful changes in financial planning that enabled an agile and effective management structure by eliminating traditional budgets. After the company's sale, Nevine continued this work with Live Future Ready, leveraging her experience to support organizations in their financial transformation efforts across various industries. In 2019, Nevine joined Hargray Communications Group as the VP of Accounting, before taking on building the Finance and Administrative functions for a broadband start-up. She is currently the Senior Vice President of Finance at Greater Technology Together, a leading network and security-as-a-service firm. 

Recognized for her experience in finance, agility, and team building, she has been featured at conferences and on podcasts. She enjoys sharing her learnings and experiences with anyone seeking to change and enable their teams meaningfully. 

You can follow Nevine on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/nevinewhite/

Podcast music courtesy of www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, Nevine discusses the challenges and success of empowering teams, the concept of embedded finance, and how transforming financial processes has fostered business agility, creativity, and resilience. Nevine details the importance of support structures, clear empowerment guidelines, and the impact of shifting from conventional budget models. Her transformative initiatives led to significant improvements in operational efficiency and organizational morale.

• 00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
• 02:12 Empowerment in the Workplace
• 03:44 Anecdote: The Importance of Clear Empowerment
• 06:44 Introducing Embedded Finance
• 10:17 Measuring Success and Overcoming Challenges
• 12:59 Transforming Finance Teams
• 18:10 The Impact of Abandoning Traditional Budgets
• 22:40 Continuous Planning and Forecasting
• 28:58 Conclusion 

Nevine's insights highlight that there’s no one-size-fits-all playbook for financial agility. Instead, transformation requires experimentation, iteration, and courage to question the sacred cows of yearly budgets. Her experiences demonstrate how finance - often seen as the last function to change - can become a catalyst for business agility, resilience, and innovation.

About Nevine White:
Beginning her 35-year career in telecom engineering, Nevine moved on to leading the FP&A function for TW Telecom for two decades. There she championed powerful changes in financial planning that enabled an agile and effective management structure by eliminating traditional budgets. After the sale of the company, Nevine continued this work with Live Future Ready, leveraging her experience to support organizations in their financial transformation efforts across various industries. In 2019, Nevine joined Hargray Communications Group as the VP Accounting, before taking on building the Finance and Administrative functions for a broadband start-up. She is currently the Senior Vice President of Finance at Greater Technology Together, a leading network and security as a service firm. 

Recognized for her experience in finance agility and building effective teams, she has been featured at conferences and on podcasts, and enjoys sharing her learnings and experiences with all who are seeking to meaningfully change and enable their teams. 

You can follow Nevine on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/nevinewhite/

Podcast music courtesy of www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, Nevine discusses the complexities of rewarding performance, advocating for rewards disconnecting from financial targets to prevent bad behavior. She emphasizes the power of recognition and simple rewards over monetary incentives. She also highlights her strategies for career growth and new process implementation, stressing the importance of defining success criteria upfront and evaluating outcomes transparently. Listen in to learn how rethinking budget processes can foster creativity, collaboration, and enduring business agility.

• 00:00 Introduction 
• 00:44 Transforming Financial Planning
• 02:14 Rewards and Recognition Schemes
• 06:21 Creative Incentives and Employee Motivation
• 11:57 HR Policies and Career Growth
• 17:15 Innovative Processes and Experimentation
• 20:18 Measuring Success and Continuous Improvement
• 26:27 Product Reviews and Organizational Conversations
• 28:17 Conclusion

Nevine's insights highlight that there’s no one-size-fits-all playbook for financial agility. Instead, transformation requires experimentation, iteration, and courage to question the sacred cows of yearly budgets. Her experiences demonstrate how finance - often seen as the last function to change - can become a catalyst for business agility, resilience, and innovation.

About Nevine White:
Beginning her 35-year career in telecom engineering, Nevine moved on to leading the FP&A function for TW Telecom for two decades. There she championed powerful changes in financial planning that enabled an agile and effective management structure by eliminating traditional budgets. After the sale of the company, Nevine continued this work with Live Future Ready, leveraging her experience to support organizations in their financial transformation efforts across various industries. In 2019, Nevine joined Hargray Communications Group as the VP Accounting, before taking on building the Finance and Administrative functions for a broadband start-up. She is currently the Senior Vice President of Finance at Greater Technology Together, a leading network and security as a service firm. 

Recognized for her experience in finance agility and building effective teams, she has been featured at conferences and on podcasts, and enjoys sharing her learnings and experiences with all who are seeking to meaningfully change and enable their teams. 

You can follow Nevine on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/nevinewhite/

Podcast music courtesy of www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, Nevine discusses the shift from traditional budgeting to agile financial planning, highlighting the benefits of continuous planning, operational agility, and real-time decision-making. She details the challenges and successes of implementing these changes, including the breakdown of old processes and the empowerment of frontline leaders. Nevine also shares insights into handling project funding, resource allocation, and fostering collaborative decision-making. Her approach showcases how rethinking budget processes can enhance creativity, collaboration, and agility in organizations.

• 00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
• 02:05 Transforming Financial Planning
• 03:18 Empowering Decision-Making
• 04:39 Navigating System Infrastructure
• 06:46 Changing Corporate Conversations
• 09:46 Handling Change Fatigue
• 13:11 Efficient Forecasting and Planning
• 17:29 Dynamic Decision-Making
• 27:39 Capital Investment Strategies
• 28:20 Conclusion

Nevine's insights highlight that there’s no one-size-fits-all playbook for financial agility. Instead, transformation requires experimentation, iteration, and courage to question the sacred cows of yearly budgets. Her experiences demonstrate how finance - often seen as the last function to change - can become a catalyst for business agility, resilience, and innovation.

About Nevine White:
Beginning her 35-year career in telecom engineering, Nevine moved on to leading the FP&A function for TW Telecom for two decades. There she championed powerful changes in financial planning that enabled an agile and effective management structure by eliminating traditional budgets. After the sale of the company, Nevine continued this work with Live Future Ready, leveraging her experience to support organizations in their financial transformation efforts across various industries. In 2019, Nevine joined Hargray Communications Group as the VP Accounting, before taking on building the Finance and Administrative functions for a broadband start-up. She is currently the Senior Vice President of Finance at Greater Technology Together, a leading network and security as a service firm. 

Recognized for her experience in finance agility and building effective teams, she has been featured at conferences and on podcasts, and enjoys sharing her learnings and experiences with all who are seeking to meaningfully change and enable their teams. 

You can follow Nevine on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/nevinewhite/

Podcast music courtesy of www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, Nevine explains how she executed the shift to rolling forecasting. She details the initial varied reactions, the creation of a robust training program, and the integration of finance teams into regional operations for real-time decision-making. Nevine also elaborates on gamification strategies, overcoming executive resistance, and the importance of continuous learning and communication. Highlighting her experience of guiding executive leadership through this transition, she emphasizes the role of proactive coaching and effective upward management.

• 00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
• 01:57 Transitioning from Traditional Budgeting to Agile Financial Planning
• 02:24 Implementing Rolling Forecasting: The First Steps
• 03:14 Training and Engaging the Organization
• 06:27 Challenges and Emotional Impact
• 08:14 Burning Platform Conversations
• 11:19 Embedding Finance in the Regions
• 14:38 Building a Collaborative Learning Environment
• 19:00 Executive Leadership Buy-In and Coaching
• 26:13 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Nevine's insights highlight that there’s no one-size-fits-all playbook for financial agility. Instead, transformation requires experimentation, iteration, and courage to question the sacred cows of yearly budgets. Her experiences demonstrate how finance - often seen as the last function to change - can become a catalyst for business agility, resilience, and innovation.

About Nevine White:
Beginning her 35-year career in telecom engineering, Nevine moved on to leading the FP&A function for TW Telecom for two decades. There she championed powerful changes in financial planning that enabled an agile and effective management structure by eliminating traditional budgets. After the sale of the company, Nevine continued this work with Live Future Ready, leveraging her experience to support organizations in their financial transformation efforts across various industries. In 2019, Nevine joined Hargray Communications Group as the VP Accounting, before taking on building the Finance and Administrative functions for a broadband start-up. She is currently the Senior Vice President of Finance at Greater Technology Together, a leading network and security as a service firm. 

Recognized for her experience in finance agility and building effective teams, she has been featured at conferences and on podcasts, and enjoys sharing her learnings and experiences with all who are seeking to meaningfully change and enable their teams. 

You can follow Nevine on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/nevinewhite/

Podcast music courtesy of www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode, Nevine shares how her journey began in the telecom industry when a bold CFO literally tossed out the company’s annual budget, sparking a search for a better way. That search led to adopting rolling forecasts and experimenting quarter by quarter - breaking and remaking processes along the way - to create a more nimble, data-driven, and responsive organization.

In this first episode you will hear Nevine's candid stories about the messiness of transformation:

• What it felt like to see six months of budget work thrown in the trash.
• Why annual budgets—rooted in 1920s manufacturing—no longer fit today’s fast-paced business environment.
• How rolling forecasts differ from “mini-budgets” and why many companies get them wrong.
• The cultural and change management challenges that arise when finance stops dictating numbers and starts empowering managers to decide in real time.
• How aligning finance with agile IT practices unlocked a “spiral of goodness” across the organization.

Nevine's insights highlight that there’s no one-size-fits-all playbook for financial agility. Instead, transformation requires experimentation, iteration, and courage to question the sacred cows of yearly budgets. Her experiences demonstrate how finance - often seen as the last function to change - can become a catalyst for business agility, resilience, and innovation.

About Nevine White:
Beginning her 35-year career in telecom engineering, Nevine moved on to leading the FP&A function for TW Telecom for two decades. There she championed powerful changes in financial planning that enabled an agile and effective management structure by eliminating traditional budgets. After the sale of the company, Nevine continued this work with Live Future Ready, leveraging her experience to support organizations in their financial transformation efforts across various industries. In 2019, Nevine joined Hargray Communications Group as the VP Accounting, before taking on building the Finance and Administrative functions for a broadband start-up. She is currently the Senior Vice President of Finance at Greater Technology Together, a leading network and security as a service firm. 

Recognized for her experience in finance agility and building effective teams, she has been featured at conferences and on podcasts, and enjoys sharing her learnings and experiences with all who are seeking to meaningfully change and enable their teams. 

You can follow Nevine on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/nevinewhite/

Podcast music courtesy of www.purple-planet.com

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Let’s face it: “culture” has become a buzzword. It’s often pitched as a magic bullet for success, but most organizations still struggle to define it—let alone get it right. In this series, Lizzie helps us move beyond the platitudes. She unpacks what culture actually is, why so many transformations fall flat, and what it really takes to build a workplace where both people and business can thrive.

We’ll explore the tools and mindsets that matter, and dig into the uncomfortable truths that often get overlooked.

In this episode:

In this episode of Agile Tales, we finish our enlightening conversation with Lizzie Benton, where she discusses the importance of conflict resolution, nonviolent communication, and the complexities surrounding diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI). Lizzie also recounts her most challenging and rewarding experiences in helping companies improve their culture, emphasizing the significance of leadership support and aligning actions with professed values. Her stories and advice offer practical tools for fostering a positive workplace culture.

• 00:00 Introduction
• 01:57 Conflict Resolution Strategies
• 04:36 The DEI Powder Keg
• 10:30 Controversial Case: Boeing and DEI
• 14:17 Challenges in Company Culture
• 20:11 Rewarding Experiences in Culture Coaching
• 23:53 Resources for Building Company Culture
• 26:31 Conclusion of Season 10 and Teaser for Season 11

About Lizzie Benton:

Lizzie is a culture coach and the founder of Liberty Mind. She helps companies evolve beyond bureaucratic structures toward more human-centered, purpose-driven workplaces. She’s worked across industries—from tech to charities to construction—always with a focus on unlocking human potential and helping teams co-create meaningful change.

Her approach blends depth and practicality, rooted in progressive practices like self-management, Liberating Structures, and Teal principles. Lizzie is a certified Holacracy Practitioner, Semco Style Expert, and TuffLeadership coach. She’s been named one of the top 30 millennials changing the world of work and has been featured in Forbes, The Metro, and The Financial Times.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Let’s face it: “culture” has become a buzzword. It’s often pitched as a magic bullet for success, but most organizations still struggle to define it—let alone get it right. In this series, Lizzie helps us move beyond the platitudes. She unpacks what culture actually is, why so many transformations fall flat, and what it really takes to build a workplace where both people and business can thrive.

We’ll explore the tools and mindsets that matter, and dig into the uncomfortable truths that often get overlooked.

In this episode:

In this episode of Our Agile Tales, we continue our conversation with Lizzie Benton, where she shares insights on integrating company culture with sustainability, embedding continuous learning, and fostering employee engagement and retention. She also explores innovative approaches to pay, promotions, and the ongoing debate of remote vs. hybrid work environments. Providing examples from progressive organizations, Lizzie illustrates the importance of co-creation, psychological safety, and empathetic feedback in building adaptable and thriving workplaces.

• 00:00 Introduction 
• 02:03 The Importance of Sustainability in Company Culture
• 04:27 Embedding Continuous Learning in Company Culture
• 07:23 The Role of Professional Development in Employee Engagement
• 10:02 Progressive Companies: Pay and Promotions in Flatter Organizations
• 16:41 Remote vs. Hybrid Work: Co-Creating the Best Environment
• 23:44 Ensuring Accountability Without Carrots and Sticks
• 29:04 Conclusion

About Lizzie Benton:

Lizzie is a culture coach and the founder of Liberty Mind. She helps companies evolve beyond bureaucratic structures toward more human-centered, purpose-driven workplaces. She’s worked across industries—from tech to charities to construction—always with a focus on unlocking human potential and helping teams co-create meaningful change.

Her approach blends depth and practicality, rooted in progressive practices like self-management, Liberating Structures, and Teal principles. Lizzie is a certified Holacracy Practitioner, Semco Style Expert, and TuffLeadership coach. She’s been named one of the top 30 millennials changing the world of work and has been featured in Forbes, The Metro, and The Financial Times.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Let’s face it: “culture” has become a buzzword. It’s often pitched as a magic bullet for success, but most organizations still struggle to define it—let alone get it right. In this series, Lizzie helps us move beyond the platitudes. She unpacks what culture actually is, why so many transformations fall flat, and what it really takes to build a workplace where both people and business can thrive.

We’ll explore the tools and mindsets that matter, and dig into the uncomfortable truths that often get overlooked.

In this episode:

In this episode of Our Agile Tales, we continue our conversation with Lizzie Benton, where she provides deep insights into the challenges and successes of self-management models, decentralizing decision-making, and rethinking roles and responsibilities within organizations. We explore practical frameworks like advice-based decision making, and discuss how even non-executive employees can catalyze cultural changes. Lizzie shares her expertise on the importance of starting small, experimenting with new practices, and the pivotal role of leadership in cultivating trust and vulnerability. In this episode we discuss diagnostic tools for assessing company culture, the significance of cultural fit in hiring, and how to integrate employee wellbeing into organizational practices. The conversation delves into common obstacles faced during culture change and the role of leadership in fostering an inclusive and vibrant workplace.

• 00:00 Introduction
• 02:11 Assessment Tools for Culture Change
• 04:51 Spreading Successful Experiments
• 06:52 Overcoming Obstacles in Culture Change
• 09:54 The Role of Leaders in Shaping Culture
• 16:00 Measuring Company Culture
• 18:39 Hiring for Cultural Fit
• 20:55 Diversity and Inclusion in the Workplace
• 25:36 Impact of Culture on Wellbeing
• 29:03 Conclusion

About Lizzie Benton:

Lizzie is a culture coach and the founder of Liberty Mind. She helps companies evolve beyond bureaucratic structures toward more human-centered, purpose-driven workplaces. She’s worked across industries—from tech to charities to construction—always with a focus on unlocking human potential and helping teams co-create meaningful change.

Her approach blends depth and practicality, rooted in progressive practices like self-management, Liberating Structures, and Teal principles. Lizzie is a certified Holacracy Practitioner, Semco Style Expert, and TuffLeadership coach. She’s been named one of the top 30 millennials changing the world of work and has been featured in Forbes, The Metro, and The Financial Times.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Let’s face it: “culture” has become a buzzword. It’s often pitched as a magic bullet for success, but most organizations still struggle to define it—let alone get it right. In this series, Lizzie helps us move beyond the platitudes. She unpacks what culture actually is, why so many transformations fall flat, and what it really takes to build a workplace where both people and business can thrive.

We’ll explore the tools and mindsets that matter, and dig into the uncomfortable truths that often get overlooked.

In this episode:

In this episode of Our Agile Tales, we continue our conversation with Lizzie Benton, where she provides deep insights into the challenges and successes of self-management models, decentralizing decision-making, and rethinking roles and responsibilities within organizations. We explore practical frameworks like advice-based decision making, and discuss how even non-executive employees can catalyze cultural changes. Lizzie shares her expertise on the importance of starting small, experimenting with new practices, and the pivotal role of leadership in cultivating trust and vulnerability. This episode offers a roadmap for organizations looking to adapt and thrive in a rapidly changing world.

• 00:00 Introduction
• 02:00 Understanding Self-Management in Organizations
• 05:28 Challenges and Strategies for Implementing Self-Management
• 11:39 Roles and Responsibilities in Modern Workplaces
• 16:34 Decentralizing Decision Making
• 24:14 Practical Steps for Cultural Change
• 28:02 Conclusion

About Lizzie Benton:

Lizzie is a culture coach and the founder of Liberty Mind. She helps companies evolve beyond bureaucratic structures toward more human-centered, purpose-driven workplaces. She’s worked across industries—from tech to charities to construction—always with a focus on unlocking human potential and helping teams co-create meaningful change.

Her approach blends depth and practicality, rooted in progressive practices like self-management, Liberating Structures, and Teal principles. Lizzie is a certified Holacracy Practitioner, Semco Style Expert, and TuffLeadership coach. She’s been named one of the top 30 millennials changing the world of work and has been featured in Forbes, The Metro, and The Financial Times.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Let’s face it: “culture” has become a buzzword. It’s often pitched as a magic bullet for success, but most organizations still struggle to define it—let alone get it right. In this series, Lizzie helps us move beyond the platitudes. She unpacks what culture actually is, why so many transformations fall flat, and what it really takes to build a workplace where both people and business can thrive.

We’ll explore the tools and mindsets that matter, and dig into the uncomfortable truths that often get overlooked.

In this episode:

We continue our conversation with Lizzie Benton and cover topics such as the importance of autonomy in teams, examples of hierarchical organizations experimenting with agile methods, and strategies for effective recruitment and team development. Lizzie emphasizes values-based recruitment, meaningful experiments within hierarchies, the significance of feedback, and the importance of coaching and listening skills. The episode also provides practical advice on improving meeting structures and fostering a culture where feedback is timely and constructive.

• 00:00 Introduction
• 02:07 Empowering Teams in Structured Organizations
• 05:32 Values-Based Recruitment and Hiring Challenges
• 10:00 Training and Developing Existing Employees
• 12:44 Effective Meetings and Decision-Making
• 16:51 The Importance of Listening and Coaching
• 20:12 Mastering Feedback in Company Culture
• 29:31 Conclusion

About Lizzie Benton:

Lizzie is a culture coach and the founder of Liberty Mind. She helps companies evolve beyond bureaucratic structures toward more human-centered, purpose-driven workplaces. She’s worked across industries—from tech to charities to construction—always with a focus on unlocking human potential and helping teams co-create meaningful change.

Her approach blends depth and practicality, rooted in progressive practices like self-management, Liberating Structures, and Teal principles. Lizzie is a certified Holacracy Practitioner, Semco Style Expert, and TuffLeadership coach. She’s been named one of the top 30 millennials changing the world of work and has been featured in Forbes, The Metro, and The Financial Times.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Let’s face it: “culture” has become a buzzword. It’s often pitched as a magic bullet for success, but most organizations still struggle to define it—let alone get it right. In this series, Lizzie helps us move beyond the platitudes. She unpacks what culture actually is, why so many transformations fall flat, and what it really takes to build a workplace where both people and business can thrive.

We’ll explore the tools and mindsets that matter, and dig into the uncomfortable truths that often get overlooked.

In this episode:

In this episode, we delve into company culture and the essence of creating better workplaces with Lizzie Benton, a culture coach and founder of Liberty Mind. Lizzie shares her insights on moving beyond bureaucratic structures to build more human-centered, purpose-driven workplaces. The conversation touches on the success of Scandinavian countries in workplace happiness, the importance of trust, the pitfalls of traditional performance management, and the benefits of dynamic re-teaming. Lizzie also emphasizes the necessity of clear purpose, the treatment of people as adults, complexity consciousness, psychological safety, and participative decision-making in building progressive organizations.

• 00:00 Introduction
• 02:01 Exploring Scandinavian Work Culture
• 05:56 The DNA of Progressive Organizations
• 11:57 The Importance of Wholeness at Work
• 15:34 Humanizing Performance Management
• 19:53 The Future of Fluid Organizations
• 23:24 Democratizing Decision Making
• 27:02 Conclusion 

About Lizzie Benton:

Lizzie is a culture coach and the founder of Liberty Mind. She helps companies evolve beyond bureaucratic structures toward more human-centered, purpose-driven workplaces. She’s worked across industries—from tech to charities to construction—always with a focus on unlocking human potential and helping teams co-create meaningful change.

Her approach blends depth and practicality, rooted in progressive practices like self-management, Liberating Structures, and Teal principles. Lizzie is a certified Holacracy Practitioner, Semco Style Expert, and TuffLeadership coach. She’s been named one of the top 30 millennials changing the world of work and has been featured in Forbes, The Metro, and The Financial Times.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Let’s face it: “culture” has become a buzzword. It’s often pitched as a magic bullet for success, but most organizations still struggle to define it—let alone get it right. In this series, Lizzie helps us move beyond the platitudes. She unpacks what culture actually is, why so many transformations fall flat, and what it really takes to build a workplace where both people and business can thrive.

We’ll explore the tools and mindsets that matter, and dig into the uncomfortable truths that often get overlooked.

In this episode:

Lizzie Benton explains her journey into culture coaching, defines company culture, and addresses misconceptions about it. She critiques the impacts of Silicon Valley's corporate culture and explains the phenomenon of 'culture washing.' The discussion extends to alternative management structures, highlighting companies like Burtzorg and ABN AMRO that have successfully adopted self-managing teams. Join us as we delve deep into creating purpose-driven, adaptable work environments.

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales Season 10
00:28 Meet Lizzie Benton: Culture Coach Extraordinaire
01:44 Defining Culture: Beyond the Buzzwords
03:12 Lizzie's Journey into Culture Coaching
04:35 Understanding Company Culture
08:39 Silicon Valley's Influence on Corporate Culture
13:30 The Problem with Traditional Hierarchies
17:03 Embracing New Ways of Working
19:32 Case Studies: Progressive Companies
29:01 Conclusion

About Lizzie Benton:

Lizzie is a culture coach and the founder of Liberty Mind. She helps companies evolve beyond bureaucratic structures toward more human-centered, purpose-driven workplaces. She’s worked across industries—from tech to charities to construction—always with a focus on unlocking human potential and helping teams co-create meaningful change.

Her approach blends depth and practicality, rooted in progressive practices like self-management, Liberating Structures, and Teal principles. Lizzie is a certified Holacracy Practitioner, Semco Style Expert, and TuffLeadership coach. She’s been named one of the top 30 millennials changing the world of work and has been featured in Forbes, The Metro, and The Financial Times.

You can learn more about Lizzie—and listen to her own podcast, Make It Thrive: The Company Culture Podcast—at libertymind.co.uk.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this final episode of Agile Tales with Michael Hamman, we discuss the concept of Inner Agility as a pivotal element for achieving business agility. Michael shares his personal experiences, both disappointing and rewarding, in helping leadership teams develop their inner capacity for agility. He emphasizes the importance of self-awareness and the courage to face discomfort for personal and organizational growth. We also touch on his book, 'Evolve Agility,' which serves as a guide for fostering an agile leadership culture from within. The episode concludes with a teaser for our upcoming season 10 of Our Agile Tales.

00:00 Introduction
01:18 Disappointing Experiences in Leadership
04:38 Challenging Yet Rewarding Experiences
08:43 Starting the Inner Agility Journey
12:44 Michael Hamman's Book: Evolve Agility
14:45 Conclusion and Season 10 Teaser

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode of 'Our Agile Tales,'  Michael Hamman talks about the significance of inner agility as a key to business agility. Michael talks about the transformative journey he advocates through his work with organizations and his book, 'Evolve Agility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out.' The episode delves into the practice of 'deliberate sensemaking,' and how it contributes to a more adaptive and authentic workplace culture. Michael emphasizes the importance of leadership and systemic changes starting from the top-level executives, advocating for a culture where awareness and complexity in meaning-making lead to more effective actions in the face of uncertainty. Books and resources for further reading on transformative leadership are also discussed.

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:13 Understanding Inner Agility
02:10 The Role of Coaches and Guides
06:06 Leadership and Organizational Transformation
11:02 The Nonlinear Nature of Change
23:50 Books and Resources for listeners
24:58 Conclusion

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode of Agile Tales, our discussion with Michael delves into the concepts of inner agility and its pivotal role in achieving business agility, highlighting Chris Argyris’ theories on espoused theory versus theory in use. Michael provides insights on the challenges of honest communication within organizations and the psychological strategies people employ to avoid discomfort. He emphasizes the importance of self-awareness and the limitations that our inner operating systems impose on our sensemaking and interactions. Michael also touches on the IDG's inner development goals and the need for methods that enhance our capacity for complex sense-making. The episode underlines that true organizational transformation stems from a deeper personal transformation and increased awareness of our underlying beliefs and assumptions.

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:13 Espoused Theory vs. Theory in Use
05:29 The Cost of Avoiding the Truth
06:53 Organizational Transformation and Human Change
11:10 Experience Wheel and Inner Agility
16:59 Understanding Our Inner Operating System
19:30 Developing Inner Capacity for Sustainable Goals
24:56 Enhancing Team Collaboration and Sensemaking
29:35 Conclusion

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

In this episode of Agile Tales, Michael Hamman emphasizes the importance of leadership agility in navigating the complexities of the 21st-century workplace. He addresses the impact of organizational politics, the need for a culture of transparency, authenticity, and integrity, and the benefits of collective intelligence in fostering innovation and effective action. He also shares anecdotes and insights on how leaders can create environments that promote psychological safety and challenge employees to achieve greater levels of performance and development.

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:24 The Hidden Layers in Organizations
02:44 The Importance of Authenticity
04:45 Challenges in Organizational Transparency
07:54 Disorienting Vocabularies
10:30 Developing People for Organizational Success
14:17 Leadership and Vulnerability
21:39 Handling Layoffs with Integrity
25:16 Collective Intelligence in Crisis
29:23 Conclusion

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:27 Cultural References and Informal Agreements
06:35 The Role of Resistance in Organizational Culture
12:19 Practical Examples of Organizational Resistance
17:55 Cover-Ups and Organizational Dysfunction
27:47 Conclusion and Next Episode Teaser

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:25 A Story of Self-Awareness in the Workplace
07:13 The Power of Self-Management and Self-Awareness
12:43 Cultural Sensitivity and Team Dynamics
19:42 The Importance of Relationship Building
27:52 Conclusion

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:29 Conversational Patterns for Inner Agility
05:22 Advocacy and Inquiry in Conversations
12:40 Impact Feedback and Nonviolent Communication
22:25 Self-Awareness in Organizations
29:22 Conclusion

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

00:00 Introduction to Our Agile Tales
02:50 Challenges in Transforming Organizations
06:51 Creating Examples to Influence Leaders
07:33 Handling Hard Truths in Teams
12:58 The Problem with Not Telling the Truth
17:33 Covering Up the Cover-Up
22:44 The Broader Impact of Avoiding Truth
26:10 Conclusion

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

You can find Michael Hamman on LinkedIn or peruse his work at Vertical Facilitator. 

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:40 A Birthday Surprise Gone Wrong
05:22 Deliberate Sense Making Explained
14:49 The Importance of Being Present
21:15 Practicing Inner Agility
28:46 Conclusion

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

You can find Michael Hamman on LinkedIn or peruse his work at Vertical Facilitator. 

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:32 Rethinking Performance Reviews
06:12 The Concept of Action Learning
09:44 Deliberate Sensemaking in Organizations
17:44 Fractal Nature of Sensemaking
20:25 Conclusion 

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

You can find Michael Hamman on LinkedIn or peruse his work at Vertical Facilitator. 

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

00:00 Introduction to Agile Tales
01:26 Understanding Deliberate Sense Making
05:19 Exploring Relational Practices
19:04 The Power of Feedback in Transformation
25:57 Positive Feedback and Acknowledgement
28:49 Conclusion

Michael Hamman is the author of Evolvagility: Growing an Agile Leadership Culture from the Inside Out. The book provides a blueprint for what it means to be an agile leader in today's complex world and offers a practical roadmap for getting there. He is the head of development at Transformation Designs and is a Co-creator at the Centre for Inner Agility.

You can find Michael Hamman on LinkedIn or peruse his work at Vertical Facilitator. 

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

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• Stop Decorating the Fish by Yishai Ashlag and Kristen Cox

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Where do most teams and departments in an organization encounter constraints? They encounter it in management, the budgeting process driven by finance and the performance management process driven by HR. When management and finance are about control, teams are constrained and the organization cannot be adaptive. E.g. no (or not enough) budget to hire the people when they need it, get the equipment and supplies in time, have the flexibility to try things out, etc. 

In this podcast series, we explore with Bjarte Bogsnes how beyond budgeting enables an organization to achieve business agility. Though this journey isn’t for the faint of heart, companies like Tesla and Equinor (formerly StatOil) are doing this today – and are being very successful at it.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Where do most teams and departments in an organization encounter constraints? They encounter it in management, the budgeting process driven by finance and the performance management process driven by HR. When management and finance are about control, teams are constrained and the organization cannot be adaptive. E.g. no (or not enough) budget to hire the people when they need it, get the equipment and supplies in time, have the flexibility to try things out, etc. 

In this podcast series, we explore with Bjarte Bogsnes how beyond budgeting enables an organization to achieve business agility. Though this journey isn’t for the faint of heart, companies like Tesla and Equinor (formerly StatOil) are doing this today – and are being very successful at it.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Where do most teams and departments in an organization encounter constraints? They encounter it in management, the budgeting process driven by finance and the performance management process driven by HR. When management and finance are about control, teams are constrained and the organization cannot be adaptive. E.g. no (or not enough) budget to hire the people when they need it, get the equipment and supplies in time, have the flexibility to try things out, etc. 

In this podcast series, we explore with Bjarte Bogsnes how going beyond the budgeting constraints helps an organization achieve business agility. Though this journey isn’t for the faint of heart, companies like Tesla and Equinor (formerly StatOil) are doing this today – and are being very successful at it.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Where do most teams and departments in an organization encounter constraints? They encounter it in management, the budgeting process driven by finance and the performance management process driven by HR. When management and finance are about control, teams are constrained and the organization cannot be adaptive. E.g. no (or not enough) budget to hire the people when they need it, get the equipment and supplies in time, have the flexibility to try things out, etc. 

In this podcast series, we explore with Bjarte Bogsnes how going beyond the budgeting constraints helps an organization achieve business agility. Though this journey isn’t for the faint of heart, companies like Tesla and Equinor (formerly StatOil) are doing this today - and are being very successful at it. 

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Where do most teams and departments in an organization encounter constraints? They encounter it in management, the budgeting process driven by finance and the performance management process driven by HR. When management and finance are about control, teams are constrained and the organization cannot be adaptive. E.g. no (or not enough) budget to hire the people when they need it, get the equipment and supplies in time, have the flexibility to try things out, etc. 

In this podcast series, we explore with Bjarte Bogsnes how going beyond the budgeting constraints helps an organization achieve business agility. Though this journey isn’t for the faint of heart, companies like Tesla and Equinor (formerly StatOil) are doing this today - and are being very successful at it. 

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Do you believe that? 

In this series, we’re talking with Marina Alex specifically about sales and agility. Her rich experience would help break any preconceived notions that we may have. We even discuss how to start the organizational agility with Sales instead of Product/Engineering.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Do you believe that? 

In this series, we’re talking with Marina Alex specifically about sales and agility. Her rich experience would help break any preconceived notions that we may have. We even discuss how to start the organizational agility with Sales instead of Product/Engineering.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Do you believe that? 

In this series, we’re talking with Marina Alex specifically about sales and agility. Her rich experience would help break any preconceived notions that we may have. We even discuss how to start the organizational agility with Sales instead of Product/Engineering.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

The conversation builds on each other, so if you didn’t listen from episode 1, you may want to go back to the previous episodes to get some background and understanding.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

The conversation builds on each other, so if you didn’t listen from episode 1, you may want to go back to the previous episodes to get some background and understanding.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

The conversation builds on each other, so if you didn’t listen from episode 1, you may want to go back to the previous episodes to get some background and understanding.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

The conversation builds on each other, so if you didn’t listen from episode 1, you may want to go back to the previous episodes to get some background and understanding.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

The conversation builds on each other, so if you didn’t listen from episode 1, you may want to go back to the previous episodes to get some background and understanding.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

The conversation builds on each other, so if you didn’t listen from episode 1, you may want to go back to the previous episodes to get some background and understanding.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

The conversation builds on each other, so if you didn’t listen from episode 1, you may want to go back to the previous episodes to get some background and understanding.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

The conversation builds on each other, so if you didn’t listen from episode 1, you may want to go back to the previous episodes to get some background and understanding.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Agile is a mindset and a habit, using some frameworks and practices. However, it is hard to be agile when we need to provide all the answers at the end of each year for the entire following year or when we report in a waterfall manner. So, the way we do budgeting, forecasting, performance assessment, rewards & recognition, and cost control can be either enabling or hindering agility. 

In this podcast, we’ll walk through an example of how we transform the whole organisation by stealth by evolving the Finance and HR departments. By evolving it this way, you achieve the transformation at a fraction of the price of traditional transformation programmes.

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about

Introducing Episode 1 of “A Tale of Two Agile Worlds”:

Here, we'll look at senior management's resistance from the US' perspective. We’ll compare and contrast the manifested behaviors of executive resistance to Agile - both overt and covert forms. We'll also see how the people perceive and react to them. 

Visit us at https://www.ouragiletales.com/about